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Ask HN: 55 years old and no experience, am I too old to get a job?
31 points by fiftyfivenoexp on July 30, 2018 | hide | past | favorite | 32 comments
I can program in many languages (ruby, python, lisp, clojure, java (no expert), scala,R, javascript ES6, Haskell (level as in rwh, lysh, I must be the yegge exception), prolog, erlang (no expert in otp), elixir (don't know phoenix), mysql (basic sql queries,normalizacion),ruby sinatra (not rails), and a little django. Linux: (bash programming >> tee grep awk). I have a degree and a PhD in math, also a CS degree (90s, 3 year time,from a European University, my final work was about matroids, Edmond's algorithm for the intersection of matroids implemented in prolog, applications to graph theory, NP-complete problems, and heuristics like in Papadimitriu). I have published some papers in complexity theory, physics and abstract math. I have a good grasp of theoretical and applied statistics. I have some knowledge of machine learning (in decreasing order: books like esl; R, ipython and sklean. Some AI knowledge (like in norvig Modern IA). My hackerrank profile is not bad (solving problem there mostly in Lisp).

But I have no experience working with a team, and is very likely I won't be able to cope with frequents tight deadlines. English is my second language. I enjoy programming and learning new skill by myself and I'm able to learn quickly.

I wonder if, at my age, I will be able to get a job as a programmer or data scientists. Any tips?



You certainly have the academic background and skill to work, but may I ask what you've been doing for the past 20 years?

If you've been working in any type of technical or academic role you'll still be a good candidate. If you haven't worked it will be difficult to land the first one, and I think becoming an expert with common web platforms such as React will help the most. Plenty of small companies are looking for people on contract, and you'll build recent work experience.


Don't ignore this question OP. Every single employer is going to wonder exactly the same thing. What have you been doing for 20 years, exactly?

If you've been tilling the rice fields in bangladesh and becoming one with nature to start your own religion, own it! You have to be forward with that information otherwise employers will get cold feet.


I think your academic career counts as experience.

I would think your best bet is data science/machine learning. If you have read and mostly understood ESL i’d think you’re basically qualified. Play around with Tensorflow/PyTorch and modern neural networks so you can say you know about deep learning.

Knowledge of “classical” statistics is a competitive advantage.

Perhaps frame yourself as a consultant or contractor, if you find you face age discrimination. The advantage of having an older person with experience and wisdom might be more apparent, vs competing for entry level jobs.


I am only a few years younger than you, American, and run a professional services company (resumes/linkedin profiles/interview coaching, academic work) in Shanghai after 24 years on/off Wall Street. Look up my email and shoot me your resume. I will give it a thorough review for glaring issues. Please give me a week as my client schedule is full. Free for you (fiftyfivenoexp) although I typically charge for the service. You can look me up on LinkedIn for background.


The following ideas are my opinions, based upon my own experiences. I don't have any data to back this up.

I wouldn't apply to immature companies (startups and similar), as I think they are going to be the most prejudiced. I think the opportunities for you will exist in healthcare, banking, govt. or utilities that need skills like yours. I feel there are lots of good paying jobs in these types of companies that would be more open hiring an older worker.

I see you have R and Python along with some SQL, perhaps this along with your PhD in math could be leveraged into a data science job, or jr position in data science.

Take a look at kaggle.com, perhaps you can do something there to get your foot in the door.


Thanks, I will try to learn more about feature engineering. Long ago I read Machine Learning for Hackers, and followed one of the author blogs about the julia language.


A lot of STEM PhD's are transitioning into data science in industry. It seems you have a lot of CS background as well, so "data engineer" might also be a role you should look into.

Also, you say you have no experience working with a team. So no collaborations? No co-authors (surely you must have some students working for you)? I see from another comment that you had to go through the tenure process. I'm sure you had some deadlines to meet there and some important requirements to meet.

As far as tips, I have found this article helpful: https://blog.insightdatascience.com/preparing-for-the-transi...


I'm not a programmer, but I got my first full time job at age 41. I was a homemaker for 2 decades before that. I put education and volunteer experience on my resume.

My recollection is that the book What color is your parachute? has some good tips for getting your first job and points out that everyone has a "first job" at some point.


With an academic background in math, there’s probably demand for your background in certain BigCos — Google; finance; anywhere investing heavily in developing new machine learning techniques. A (non-spammy) recruiter may also be able to help you find the companies that are looking for your expertise.


I am in a similar situation and i am happy about it. I don't belong to anyone; that means i can work for anyone. This gives the flexibility to get involved in projects I am truly passionate about. There are things maturity does better; one of the those is the ability to think logically, clearly and abstractly. Based on your skills, you would be under selling yourself as a programmer because you have more than just programming skills. What you have are problem solving skills. If I were you, I would look for consultant & advisor jobs. I know a couple a companies that look for people with your set of skills, shoot me an email if you're interested.


Jesus I wish I could absorb your knowledge, reading that paragraph gives me anxiety. It would be so stupid and against everything I could understand of rational decision making if you couldn't get hired.


In my 40s, I just started working my first real job as a data scientist. I'm a polymath but I've lived most of my life as an entrepreneur and party boy. I've helped out at other people's startups before but usually got bored fast and quit. This time feels like it's going to be different. The work is interesting and I feel a genuine sense of purpose. I guess it was finally time to grow up.


Yeah, you can, if you can avoid startups and cool dudes. Im pretty sure you if you are proficient enough, you can get a job in Enterprise/IT.


Did you try already? Not sure what your CV looks like but the way you list your experience is a bit concerning. That's quite a lot of stuff. And you say you don't have much to show for it. Most people are going to assume you're mediocre or even a beginner in all of these. Say less and people will assume more competence.


i would build a profile on some(many) freelancing site(s), and take a couple programming gigs to build up a portfolio on Linkedin. From there, apply to as many jobs as you seem fit while polishing your soft skills ( deadlines and teams are a harsh reality ).


Thanks, I don't have a portfolio. I think is time to create one.


Pretty sure if you can do statistics you can get work. I would stop referring to yourself as No Experience, it's not true. If you're successful in academia, you probaly have lots of experience.


A related Ask HN thread from last week that may help shed some light:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17624888


If you're in Algiers, Algeria, can you get in touch? We'll work something up.


If you want to start small and take on a website or mobile app look at gigster


Willing to relocate? Friends company should be hiring. Pm me hn@raindeer.io


Don't Forget: Age is just a number!


But unfortunatly is a bounded number. Going to see Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol with my sons just to get some tips about how to overcome difficulties. Thanks all for the positive feedback. I tried to upvote everyone, but can't do it because I replied and hn rules. Thanks folks.


Lots of good comments. It sounds like you have lots of programming breadth, the question is how much depth you have, can you be a regular programmer or are you a special area of knowledge type programmer. You don't sound like a UI programmer necessarily from that skillset.

1. Data science is often deeper stats knowledge, less programming (ie can sketch something up together using python and libraries, then a programmer can take over to make it production). But you have to understand stats and ideas. I'd expect you to do this or pick it up. Most CS people aren't very deep in stats, so you can do better than them in that area.

2. Regular programming jobs - I think this would be a bit harder to start in. Companies will not know how to evaluate all that various different experience. So you'll have to find something that matches up with a companies needs. a. Maybe some scientific or statistical scientific programming, other than data science? b. Maybe you can find some open source project to contribute to to show you capabilities.

You could take a very short term gig to build up your resume and confidence of what programming is like today.

Interviews - interviews at many companies are unfortunately more about passing a potentially tricky design problem. Try to do one or two problems every day or two at one of the "leet" code type sites. When I interviewed recently at several big-software-cos I was surprised to get multiple leet code problems - and I'm a software engineer with 20 years experience, working on infrastructure.

You should search for data science interview questions to get ready for that. There's huge demand for different kinds of software expertise, but you will have to work and network to get through until you can talk to engineers and interview.

I could boil all this down to:

1. data science looks very promising for you 2. look on linked-in for companies hiring 3. search for data science interview questions on the web 4. interview and get that job!


> Maybe you can find some open source project to contribute to to show you capabilities.

I came here to say this. It's a big deal. It proves that you can write quality code and work with a team. It's also trendy, which doesn't hurt.


> I came here to say this. It's a big deal. It proves that you can write quality code and work with a team. It's also trendy, which doesn't hurt.

Absolutely. If were a model with a portfolio with no pictures in it; you won't get hired.

So it has to be full; of valid content you can share. People want to see it.

Otherwise you won't be taken as seriously


Nope, it's an indication.


Do you know haskell or C++?


I'd say you are infinitely more qualified than me. Network hard, in person, apply to a lot of places.

I'd actually be curious to hear if you succeed because if you don't, then I'm certain is horribly wrong and biased with current hiring practices


Thanks for the tips. Anyway, I think that if all that is needed is to learn the latest web framework and measure code by lines of code/hour that knowledge is of little use. Now going to gym, just to stay in good shape. I see you are brave by your name.


Don't learn the latest web framework, you should leverage your current knowledge. Web development is not a good choice for you.

And I say this without the implicit prejudice I noticed in your comment, as I'm a web developer myself, I had to learn "the latest web framework" to get a job, and I like it.

Also, I never heard about such a thing as measuding lines of code per hour


It depends. I had a sysadmin consulting co. in high school that serviced nuclear, mech and thermo engineering companies. ML/AI, scientific and other specialized software eng are rarely picky in anything but pedigree and experience. For general-purpose coding, I wouldn’t bother unless you’re hackathon-insanely productive... also such jobs are more standardized and therefore more readily outsourced.

Haskell (biceps emojis here)




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