It only affects people who care about what other people wear, and those people shouldn’t have any sort of societal influence because that’s stupid. Name literally one reason that wearing pajamas in public will cause another person actual harm and I’ll take back this statement.
There are a lot of things that don’t cause “actual harm” (which is itself a very narrow and short-sighted metric to exclusively focus on) but are probably important to worry about. Clearly people care about “cultural things” even if you personally don’t care.
That’s the thing, I do care. I care that people should have freedom of self expression. My daughters are 18 and 19. Some day soon I’ll be the parent their boyfriends will come home to meet. I hope they feel they have the freedom to wear what they’re comfortable in and that represents their genuine identity.
So yes of course context matters, we are social beings, but expectations of what is acceptable changes. I’ve seen it change in my lifetime, and that happens by people pushing the boundaries. Good luck to them.
Some day soon I’ll be the parent their boyfriends will come home to meet. I hope they feel they have the freedom to wear what they’re comfortable in and that represents their genuine identity.
Really? My hope is that I don't raise my daughter so poorly she ends up with a slob who wears pyjama in public.
Sure. Nothing I said implies I want them to have slobs for boyfriends, or would be happy if they did. I raised my girls to confidently exercise critical thinking and have decent values, but at this point they’re out in the world making their own decisions. It’s up to them now.
I raised my girls to confidently exercise critical thinking and have decent values, but at this point they’re out in the world making their own decisions.
I hope my son finds love and kindness with literally anyone he loves and enjoys, but that’s just me. Maybe other people don’t want their kids to be happy?
Maybe other people don’t want their kids to be happy?
Yeah you're just a better parent than everyone else. Congratulations, you can order yourself a "worlds best dad" mug and with you it won't even be a joke!
You can hope, but it’s nowhere within your circle of control.
Every non-parent says “my kid will never…”, which is comical.
The most surprising part of parenting to me was how wildly different each child’s personality and temperament are, and how little control I have to affect any of it.
My take on it is that there's no point using coercion to force kids to comply with your values and preferences. That will work while you have direct control over their lives as a parent, but the moment they're free adults living away from home, you have no further control and therefore no further say or influence in their lives.
I'm not saying you shouldn't exorcise control at all, as a parent you're responsible for their safety and behaviour. I just mean that coercion should be an emergency backstop that you use as little as possible.
The best approach is to explain why you are asking them to behave a certain way, and why you think certain choices in their lives are preferable, because you think they will lead to them having better lives. Drugs is a classic example, I tried weed when I was in my 20s but never anything stronger. I tried cigarettes. Ive been honest with my kids about it, and explained why I thought stronger drugs weren't for me, and how I saw them affect people I knew. I think that built a lot of trust. The objective is to give them the framing so that when I'm not there and they have an opportunity to try drugs, they will be able to make reasoned informed decisions that they take responsibility for. The same goes for sex, or dangerous sports, or any risk.
Sure, there's nature and nurture in play. But foregoing your responsibility to nurture because of the strength of nature is not a path I want to go down.
Like what? Name one thing that causes no physical or emotional harm to anyone but we should still care to ban it. If you can make three, I’ll (figuratively) eat my shoe.
Would you dress that way to meet your partner's parents for the first time? Or to see a friend you haven't seen in years? Or to represent your company at an event? What about going somewhere where you are expected to be a role model? Of course not. That's because you give a shit about the impression you give in those situations and understand the kind of atmosphere and impression it gives if you dress like a bum.
Now try having that same level of respect for your community, for your public spaces, for the people who share those public spaces with you. It's called living in a community.
What you call respect, I call conformity. If I'm representing my company at an event, I have to conform in my dress because I'm putting my personal identity aside to represent the company. If I'm meeting my partner's parents, I conform to show submission to the conservative dress code standards they grew up with.
Meeting an old friend? I'd wear something fun - maybe a nice dress, maybe fishnets and a choker. Depends on the friend.
I'd rather not go back to the 1920s where everyone had to wear suits. It's nice being able to express myself.
I’m personally way more offended by people covered head to toe in gaudy all-over logo print “high end” sweatshop-made fashion that will end up on the racks in resale shops for decades because it’s so tacky, and probably made out of non-sustainable animal leather from mistreated animals too. This is without even getting into the climate impact of disposable fashion in general and leather in particular.
I sleep naked, so I doubt I would go out naked. I do wear Hawaiian aloha shirts to business meetings, even on the mainland, because I don’t care about conforming to the mainland ideal of business attire. I’ve definitely been treated differently just for aloha shirts, so I basically think you guys will complain about anything not “normal”.
Would you hang out in your pajamas with your best buds? Of course you would. Try having the same level of comfort with your community, with your public spaces, with the people who share those public spaces with you. It's called living a normal, happy life.
I wouldn't but that is purely because of the social expectation which is grounded in nothing. Moving away from expectations that are based on arbitrary status signaling is a good thing.
Are oversized billboards harmful? Do advertisements on every surface of public space cause physical harm? Is a yard full of non-toxic junk poisonous to its neighbors? Do parking lots lining every Main Street cause anyone direct physical harm? Is the person cutting the queue an assault? Does litter harm your being? Do gas powered leaf blowers? We’ll, probably, but that’s not why we hate them!
All these acts belie any notion that maintaining our shared spaces is a personal responsibility and that those spaces could hame some function beyond selling or maximizing immediate personal utility - whether that be inspiring wonder, awe, tranquility, community or contemplation. Consider the public spaces we actually choose to visit, or why we built them in the first place.
I don’t wish to enforce a dress code on anyone. All the same, wearing pajamas in public doesn’t read as a defiant act of personal expression to me.
There was a post a while ago about counter-signaling: When a CEO rides their bike to work, it's a "good" signal - they're being green, getting exercise, etc. When a teenager rides their bike to work, not so much - it probably means they can't afford a car. Basically that the same action can mean different things depending on context.
Pajamas in public is another of these, but has meaning for the community rather than the individual: It can mean either not caring, or it can mean that it's a safe, friendly community (like we had in the suburbs I grew up in). It depends on the larger context, and people are concerned it more likely than not has the first meaning. And plenty more bad stuff comes alongside not caring.
